A few thoughts on the rumored change:
First, as others have mentioned, the timing makes me a bit skeptical. Why would they make the change at the beginning of the service year?
Second, lots of people mention the pre-1999 requirement of 90 hours per month. Not be a nit-picker, but the requirement was actually 83.333 hours per month (1000 hours divided by 12 months); 90 was just recommended for scheduling/planning purposes.
Third, looking at it historically, this would be a tremendous change from the 1940s. According to the July 1, 1943 WT, regular pioneers had a 150 hour quota. Thus, the trajectory resembles the following: 150 ----> 100 ----> 83 ----> 70 ----> 50.
Finally, if this rumor is true, how in the world can they call it "full-time service"? I had a hard time with that term when I was a pioneer in the old days. How much more so if it's only 50 hours per month? Lots of us with full-time jobs work 50 or more hours per week!
Olin Moyles Ghost
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Olin Moyles Ghost
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Review of the 2008 Guided by Gods Spirit District Convention
by Olin Moyles Ghost ini attended the guided by gods spirit district convention this summer.
out of an abundance of caution (some may say paranoia), i will not elaborate further on when and where i feasted at jehovahs table.
my observations on the program are below.
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Olin Moyles Ghost
I attended the Guided by God’s Spirit District Convention this summer. Out of an abundance of caution (some may say paranoia), I will not elaborate further on when and where I feasted at Jehovah’s table. My observations on the program are below.
Friday: College is Evil
Friday’s program was primarily directed to young people. Not surprisingly, higher education was persistently and consistently bashed. This came to the forefront during the interview segments. Two examples come to mind.
One was a young brother who was attending a community college with the intention of completing two years of his education, then transferring to a university for the remaining two years of his engineering degree. He mentioned that attending one of the recent conventions motivated him to drop out of community college and take up pioneering.
Another young man gave up the prospect of an athletic scholarship in order to enter the pioneer work. Now, I don’t remember why he was in a position to qualify for an athletic scholarship being that JWs frown upon school sports. Nonetheless, he was proud to have turned down higher education.
These are just two examples. But I think you get the picture. College is bad.
Saturday: Get Out in Service, Slackers!
Saturday had a lot of talks about field service. Talks about the “ministry” are extra boring. Fortunately, there were a few talks that were at least mildly interesting...but probably not for the reasons the FDS intended.
One of the morning talks included an interview with an older brother who was baptized in 1958. He mentioned (candidly) that he thought he would see the paradise in 1958, and that endurance is a challenge because the wicked system is still going on. The brother said “so, I hope it will come this year; and if id doesn’t come this year, I hope it will come next year.” Then, he mentioned that staying active in field service keeps him focused.
Talk: “The Minding of the Spirit Means Life and Peace”
The focus of this talk was to reach out for privileges. It seems clear that not enough JWs are reaching out for privileges of service. I also noticed a similar theme in one of the talks at a recent circuit assembly. I have also noticed such a trend among JWs that I know. Lots of brothers that I know have no real desire to become Servants or Elders. Others are content to remain as Servants and do not want the extra pressure of being an Elder. Of course, there are still plenty of go-getters and folks who want the power and position, but there are plenty of folks who just can’t be bothered with it.
This talk also mentioned the recent Bethel dress and grooming brochure. The speaker (and I believe this was a manuscript talk) stated that we should apply these guidelines at the meetings and on other occasions. He stated that “we’re supposed to puzzle the world, not our brothers.”
There was also an interview with a young pioneer brother who kept getting promoted at his job. So, he quit the job and Jehovah provided a great small business opportunity that allowed him to continue pioneering.
Talk: “Keep Yourself in God’s Love”
Of course, this talk culminated in the release of the book of the same name. This talk contained quite a bit of material on respecting authority (that is, the FDS). The reason it’s difficult for us to submit to the FDS is because (1) humans are imperfect, and (2) we have an inborn tendency to rebel. Ok, great, thanks. It’s all my fault. Of course.
We need to trust those whom Jehovah trusts and not be like those murmuring Israelites. Side note: whenever a talk mentions the murmuring Israelites, I wonder whether the speaker has actually read the account in the Bible. If so, he would realize that Jehovah provided no fewer than six miraculous indications that Moses and Aaron were his channel:
(1) when God appointed Moses to deliver the Israelites, Moses was afraid the Israelites wouldn’t believe him, so God gave Moses the power to turn his staff into a snake.
(2) 10 plagues on Egypt, the last 6 of which only affected the Egyptians
(3) Jehovah led the Israelites by a pillar of cloud by day and fire by night
(4) Jehovah used Moses to part the Red Sea
(5) even after all that, Korah, et al., rebelled, so God killed them (Numbers 16)
(6) even after all that, God wanted to show once and for all who he supported, so he had a man from each tribe (Aaron for Levi) place a staff in the tabernacle overnight; the one that sprouted flowers the next morning was the one God chose. (Numbers 17)
Sunday: Keep Your Urgency and Submit to the FDS
For lots of folks, the drama is the highlight of the convention. This year’s drama has been written about ad nauseam on this board and I don’t have much to add.
The morning session included a long symposium about the fruitage of the spirit. I think this is a good idea. Yes, I have some problems with the execution (it’s funny how each fruitage of the spirit can be tied back to field service). But, I have to give the WTS an ‘A-’ for effort on this symposium.
Talk: “Loyally Serving with Jehovah’s Spirit-Directed Organization”
This was given by the convention overseer (a local brother, not a CO/DO/Bethel speaker). The meat of this talk consisted of two primary pieces of evidence that the organization is guided by God’s spirit: (1) the preaching work, and (2) clean conduct.
(1) Preaching Work: The good news has been preached for almost 100 years. The only thing that could keep all these people preaching is the holy spirit. He used 2 Cor. 2:16 and 3:3 to allege that JW converts are “letters of recommendation” for the organization. He also read Matt. 28:19-20 and stated that God’s spirit-directed organization accomplishes the same thing as the disciples by the same power.
(2) Clean Conduct: He pointed out the brotherhood evident at international conventions and through help after natural disasters. He stated (and I agree) that “real love is engendered, not by rules, but by spirit.”
He also stated that “we need to be absolutely confident in the organization in these last days.” There was some talk of loyalty and future persecution. -
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JWs - the Next Generation
by Olin Moyles Ghost inmy peer group (post-1975 born-in jws) seems to approach the jw religion in a different manner than earlier generations.
now, these folks still believe the wts is "the truth" and if you say anything that sounds "apostate" they start freaking out.
but, make no mistake, these jws are not your parents' witnesses.
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Olin Moyles Ghost
Thanks for the comments, esp. those with a few more years under their belt.
I'm not sure if I need to clarify, but the "young" JWs I'm talking about are in their (our) late 20s/early 30s. Most are married, many have a kid or 2. So, these aren't just wild 'n rebellious JW teens.
Some other things I've noticed about this generation of JWs:
Even though the WTS has been hammering education for the past few years, they still talk about sending their kids to college.
There are quite a few DINKs (dual-income, no kids)--where the wife may have been a pioneer for several years previous. And these aren't cases where they're struggling to make ends meet. Rather, they maintain a nice standard of living (new cars, vacations, gadgets, etc.)
Did I mention the vacations? When I was growing up as a JW, most of the friends were lucky to get a week at the beach. My generation seems to take a vacation every 2-3 months!
All in all, I don't see much of a sense of urgency in this crowd. Sure, they still believe the WTS is "the truth" and they still go to the meetings and service and shun DF'd people and the like, but I don't see the same gung-ho spirit that I saw in my parents' generation. Of course, this is just one man's impression...
I think it's a result of the 1995 generation change and just a general Armageddon fatigue that sets in when you're part of a sect that's been falsely prophecying the end of the world for 130 years. -
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JWs - the Next Generation
by Olin Moyles Ghost inmy peer group (post-1975 born-in jws) seems to approach the jw religion in a different manner than earlier generations.
now, these folks still believe the wts is "the truth" and if you say anything that sounds "apostate" they start freaking out.
but, make no mistake, these jws are not your parents' witnesses.
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Olin Moyles Ghost
My peer group (post-1975 born-in JWs) seems to approach the JW religion in a different manner than earlier generations. Now, these folks still believe the WTS is "the truth" and if you say anything that sounds "apostate" they start freaking out. But, make no mistake, these JWs are not your parents' witnesses. I should point out that these are not fringe JWs...they include Ministerial Servants, pioneers, and other "solid" publishers. Some examples follow:
R-rated movies: Borat, Old School, Wedding Crashers, and the like are favorites among my JW friends
Music: rap, metal, edgy modern rock are not considered a big deal
Holidays: on St. Patrick's day, lots of the JWs I know go to the pubs and "celebrate" by getting hammered on green beer
Drinking: you should see the piles of empties after their parties
Dirty jokes/profanity: worse than the "worldly" people I work with
Anyway, has anyone else noticed this new generation of JWs? -
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Anyone remember this former C.O.: Kevin Wright?
by Olin Moyles Ghost induring the early 2000s, kevin wright was the c.o.
for a circuit that included several of my friends.
i remember hearing my friends complain about what a tool this guy was--and these complainers weren't just "lowly" publishers--some of them were elders and pioneers.
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Olin Moyles Ghost
Bump for all the single sisters...
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Do JWs really believe the end is near?
by keyser soze inor do they merely pay lip service to the idea?
i have no doubt that some of them sincerely believe.
but when i was a kid, growing up in the '80s, i didn't know of a single witness, myself included, who didn't believe the end was close.
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Olin Moyles Ghost
This is a great topic.
My JW friends in their 20s and 30s are the classic example of cognitive dissonance. When it comes up, they will spout the WT line that [insert news item here] means the end is near. But, at the same time, they are buying houses, having kids, and even taking *gasp* college courses in order to get promotions at their *gasp* full-time jobs. -
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Judge Rutherford's Air Conditioning at Bethel
by VM44 ini recall reading long ago (so long ago i don't recall where) that someone asked judge rutherford why his office at bethel, brooklyn had an air conditioning unit while the workers in the printing factory below had to work in the heat.. rutherford's answer was that the air conditioning unit was a gift!.
does anyone also recall reading this?.
wouldn't rutherford feel a little guilty about enjoying cool air while the people downstairs were working all day under hot and humid conditions?.
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Olin Moyles Ghost
The air conditioning issue came up in Moyle's trial. Supposedly Van Amburgh had A/C before the Judge did. Nonetheless, the Judge had an entire air conditioned floor in the 1930s...hard to argue he was "one of the guys" or even "first among equals."
By the way, Moyle sued the WBTS and the individual members of the board of the Society (including Rutherford, Knorr, and Franz) for libel based on two WT articles--one of which mentioned him by name and the other described him without mentioning his name. He sued for $100k and was awarded $30k by the jury at trial. On appeal, the court cut the verdict in half, so Moyle only got $15k. He lived about 25 years after the suit, so he had the opportunity to spend the money...after he paid his lawyer, of course! -
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This good news will be preached to all the inhabited earth.....
by jefferywhat inwhat about these guys?
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http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,23782262-2,00.html .
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Olin Moyles Ghost
JWFacts said:
A paradox that shows how ridiculous the idea that only JWs will be saved is:
1. If a JW claims these people will die at Armageddon it paints Jehovah as cruel, unfair and lacking in justice for murdering people at Armageddon who have never heard of him and had the chance to worship him - on the other hand
2. If a JW claims that since these people have not been witnessed to, Jehovah may save them anyway, then being preached to is an unfair dis advantage, as it puts people who have rejected JWs on Jehovah's muderous radar, but gives people unreached by JWs a chance to escape destruction.
My reply:
Exactly! I born into the JW religion, but have never believed that only JWs would be saved. Thus, even before I started really doubting that the JWs had the truth, I used to think that the preaching work disadvantaged the people we witnessed to. Perhaps this is why I never took the preaching work seriously... -
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Anyone know who wrote the Truth book?
by Olin Moyles Ghost inas a kid, i remember hearing that "the truth that leads to everlasting life" was the best-selling book of all time besides the bible.
if that's true, then whoever wrote the "truth" book is the second-best-selling author in the history of the world--second only to god!
ray franz's books mention the authors of several society publications, but i don't believe he says who wrote the truth book.
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Olin Moyles Ghost
Thanks for all the replies: both funny and serious.
Barbara, that's a neat story about Peloyan. Thanks for sharing that with us. I really enjoy your (and others') Bethel anecdotes. -
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An idea for those with "believing" mates
by Olin Moyles Ghost inin my short time on this board, i have noticed that there are many of us whose spouses do not yet share our balanced perception of the society.
the following suggestion is something i use with mrs. ghost from time to time.
as always, your mileage may vary.
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Olin Moyles Ghost
Oompa: "is The Finished Mystery the same as the burgandy Babylon book with the seperate question book?"
Actually not; you may be thinking of "Then is Finished the Mystery of God"--a 60s/70s psychadelic masterpiece from The Oracle himself, Fred Franz. I'm talking about "The Finished Mystery" which is the 7th volume of studies in the scriptures, released in 1917.